Nascarbuc

The Crew is Ubisoft's Next-Gen Racing Game - E3 Newsroom - GameSpot Video

McInnis has been throwing out a few numbers off the top of his head: 500sq km, 10k miles of roads, 2 hours to drive from coast to coast. Not sure which ones make sense (Once burnt - Horizon - twice shy), but the road network looks incredibly dense.

I'm worried by the lack of a cockpit view, but the game will still be in development for many months so it's too early to be disappointed.

EDIT: The Guardian says 5K sq km, a good few hours to drive from NYC to LA, and NYC is roughly the size of GTA IV's Liberty City.

The Crew – preview | Technology | guardian.co.uk

@Rollingtheboy

You would have a point if the tools were meant to be used by only a handful of mature, business-friendly modders.

I haven't been focusing exclusively on the French modding scene for the past 4 years so I noticed what was happening in the larger community responsible for the overwhelming majority of mods: modders were always trying to outdo each other. The new modders would do cars already released by the most notorious modders just to see how they measured up. Then in turn the more experienced ones would do in just a few days the exact same car it took a 'rising star' weeks to finish, just to show who's boss. It happened all the time. You think they won't have a field day going head to head with pro designers? Rubbing Eden's nose into how much better Forza 3/4 look and whatnot? You can expect at least 3 different versions of each and every car Eden will release. And that's not counting the Russian kids who invariably steal mods, touch them slightly and release them under their own name.

@DJey

You're making valid points. I can't really find much to disagree with, again I can only somewhat enjoy the game myself because of modding! It would be hypocritical of me to slam modders or anyone else.

My only real point of contention would be this:

"If there are official addons packs WITH QUALITY, why would this prevent them to be sold ?"

Because modders lift off models of similar or even higher quality and offer them for free. Eden's budget is a fraction of Turn 10/Slightly Mad's. I mean both are owned by multi-billion dollar corporations while Eden is owned by a small outfit that's been teetering on the brink of bankruptcy for over a decade. So if Eden spends a great deal of its small budget on getting high quality cars made, and modders flood the market with free cars of similar or higher quality, who's gonna buy Eden's cars?

Gamers aren't a kind and understanding bunch as a whole. I always think I hate Atari/Eden more than anything in the world until I read a bunch of brutal comments attacking Atari for basically not having Microsoft or EA's kind of market cap. Then I remember that what I hate more than anything is people who bully David because Goliath is so much stronger and cooler.

Even among console players, having to buy a half-dozen cars when PC gamers get the same ones and tons of other great cars for free might just alienate those who haven't yet had enough.

But hey It's just speculation on my part. Let the chips fall where they may. And yeah it's true that when I get caught up on the devil's advocate side part of me tends to forget that Atari & Eden made their beds.

PS: salut a toi! Mais je ne suis pas DE Nice - crois moi les locaux ne ratent jamais une occasion de te le rappeler.

@iLLusion

TDU 2 is a major disappointment and an insult to TDU 1 fans. From what I gather Atari wanted a pure arcade fun game while Eden wanted to stay as close to TDU 1 as possible and pushed back against the publisher's vision. This game is the result of two conflicting visions, poor executive decisions, budget cuts that have forced the departure of essential talent while preventing the recruitment of fresh talent for many years. The game failed to attract a large enough number of casual players and it alienated the loyal hardcore crowd. Dude... I can't play the game without cursing them, and the cam hack that enables seat adjustment and TrackIR support is the only reason I didn't uninstall that mess soon after release. The reason I still play it today is because hackers found a way to decrypt cpr files, allowing me to tinker with the weather, time cycle and AI drivers. Otherwise I'd stick with games with a much better driving model like... Crash Time 4. So don't think for a second that I'm against modding and hacking.

But here's the thing. We aren't privy to what's going on at Atari and Eden. The only things that are currently known are:

- On release day, TDU 2 producer Olivier Raffard informs a local website of Eden's plans to release hardcore mode after release, as DLC. Explains Eden's understanding that while they need to make the game accessible to a large number of players they also understand that they will need to push content that satisfies the loyal, hardcore players in the long run.

- Launch is a disaster, bringing Atari to slash Eden's workforce down to 30 employees.

- Eden management, in a Q&A with Gamasutra, explain that they are in a conflict with Atari over severance pay for fired employees, but they also ask for TDU 2's sales figures because they believe the game can be a strong seller in the long run. What does that tell us? That Atari wanted to pull the plug and Eden managed to convince them to keep the game afloat. No need to be a rocket scientist to figure it out.

- With only 30 employees left, and another project in the works, things can't happen overnight. It took them long enough to release DLC 1.

- DLC will include bikes and auction centers among other, currently unknown things. I don't care about either but what that tells me is that their priority is to bring back major TDU 1 features.

This is the situation as of today: we don't know what's what. We can only speculate. As I'm typing this, Atari's stock is taking a beating like it has for weeks now. The company's ability to keep operating could be in question in a matter of weeks. Rumors of a takeover have become more persitent, so a new owner could be announced tomorrow morning and Eden's shutdown the next day. But, I can't help but think that they have spent years on this game and even though they were down to just 30 guys they still believe in the title and want to improve it. Again, things won't happen overnight, if they even happen at all. In spite of all the rage a lot of us feel, me included, I think they should get a chance to redeem themselves. There is a possibility they care about the game and are working hard with limited resources to improve it so we shouldn't be trying to sabotage their effort. If I'm wrong and they prove that they don't give two s..ts about players then I hope they all get fired and never find a job in that industry ever again.

@Ozzmcom

90% of players are happy with the handling. Handling sucks for us FFB wheel users because of poor wheel support & FFB and the lack of a true HC mode. The Eden team have not made a statement vis-a-vis what makes the handling suck for us.

I'm supporting DJey too, I just wish he'd hold on to a tool that can endanger the game's future. I'd rather Eden try and then let modder try if Eden fail rather than cause Eden to fail and then find out modders can't do anything to solve our problems. Then we're screwed.

And finally I'm not slagging off modders. Without a handful of guys like Tool831 there wouldn't have been a TDU community and consequently no TDU 2. But there is a reality: modders face none of the economic constraints that Atari/Eden face. Atari can't just lift off cars from other games and convert them to TDU 2. It's not a hobby for them, it's their livelihood.

@ScoobSTi

That's exactly how I feel about the whole thing. I also hope the threat of killing off their potential DLC revenue will help Eden realize they have to get off their pedestal and communicate more directly with the community.

I wish you'd keep the TDU2 repacker under wrap until Eden release the addon cars they already had made - like the Rabcat models, officially drop support for the game, or shut down. Otherwise it's gonna hurt their ability to keep development going. Each car cost them over $20k to have made and you know modders are going to focus on the same cars just to stick it to them. Atari/Eden can't compete with teenagers who can just steal and convert stuff in their spare time at no cost and without consequences. At the very least it can kill any potential revenue from the PC platform, endangering its support. It could even hurt DLC sales on consoles. EA sells 2-3 million copies of each of its racing games before they even get out of bed. They only release PC versions for pocket money. Atari/Eden don't have that luxury. Every sale counts for the game having a chance to survive.

A BNK repacker won't bring decent wheel support or FFB. Eden's next couple DLCs might. At least we know they worked on a HC mode and planned to release it as DLC. They knew they had to focus on hardcore players in the long run. So please let them release a couple DLCs before deciding if it's worth releasing a repacker.

No problem. It's weird that there's nothing on either tdu2.fr or the official forums though. Things should become interesting in the next 2 hours though.

All isn't lost. Diablo and possibly tdu2.fr's webmaster said that at first, very very few people would get in, and Eden would add more soon, logically when their servers have proven stable enough.

Does anyone have a reliable source saying GTA V will be at E3? Because the closest I've found so far is an analyst who believes Rockstar will announce the game before E3 but nothing about the actual game being shown at the conference.

Will there be more than just one big city and a small sort of community, or just sparse pairs of houses like TDU1? eg. subdivision-type areas around the map, not just one population centre.

You will find the answer on this large and detailed map:

http://img24.imageshack.us/i/tdu2oxm1.jpg/

My question: Is TrackIR still supported (PC version) ?

Nascarbuc maybe you are right but anyway i prefer the game to have a complete ability to walk rather than to have it restricted to specific places.

i already read the article and theres no mention of any restriction like you say (malls,dealership) maybe in the other article.

 

talking about disappointment im already disappointed and im not only referring to graphics but also to other things like that the game is going to feel dead again, there wont be any kind of life forms :) except for the online players (and it doesnt have to do anything with running over people like in gta).

Nothing is cast in stone, rather it is implied in the reviews I've read so far. I'm a sucker for total freedom so the ability to walk, and do just about anything one can do in GTA4 or Far Cry 2 (okay... short of killing people or destroying property) is a huge want for me.

I agree with the lack of pedestrians, it seems to be the next frontier. It used to be damages, but now that car manufacturers have more or less had to resign themselves to the idea that their babies could be scratched virtually, now they'll have to be convinced their brand wont suffer when little Timmy runs over virtual people. Add the technological challenge and the drain on computing resources to the equation, and I don't expect this feature for a few years. And I've found myself driving in really dead places, like the northeast of France in August, or parts of rural Italy on Sundays, so a lifeless rural mediterranean island doesn't bother me much.

;300126']Maybe I'm just a little too hopefully, but I would love to be able to exit my car once on the yacht (a la that Edonis yacht posted somewhere), walk to the bridge, and then drive/pilot/captain/make the boat move to another port on the island.

 

That would be amazing. But probably too hopefully.

 

-Leadfoot

One review mentioned additional Islands as possible DLCs and Eden's boss clearly said they are going to keep working on improving the game for as long as it is profitable. Given TDU 1's longevity it's safe to assume the game will evolve for at least 2 years.

Now for the kicker: Eden is primarily Atari's R&D dept. They're the ones in charge of evolving internal development techs so I wouldn't be surprised if they used TDU2 to test different concept or tools, like Bethesda did with Fallout 3 DLCs.

If the community demands new playgrounds Eden will have to devise a way to travel between them. Bike handling is their priority so they'll work on solving this problem first but after that I don't think anything's off the table.

"Players can not only walk freely around their cars - even when they're sat on the starting line waiting for a race" -

 

if this is true we probably will be able to walk out from the car everywhere(maybe),

if the player can walk around the car when hes at the start line of the race then we might be able to walk anywhere on the map.

 

(we cant be 100% sure about the walking ability so this phrase is more convincing though eden might change it)

You should go back and read the full sentence. Based on this preview and the previous ones it is almost certain that the walking will be restricted to designated areas (dealerships, malls, race spots etc...). I hope to be wrong but I don't want to set myself up for disappointment.

It's not unreasonable to think we might end up with jet skis and whatnot in the future. Eden have said they're in it for the long haul, this time and will work on expanding the game in whatever direction and for however long the community wants. Bikes have been mentioned as possible DLCs, as well as islands. So, who knows...

Driv3r was released a long time ago, you could get out of the car and walk around the open world. It was clumsy but enjoyable.

More recently, Far Cry 2 has improved the model and you could seamlessly get in and out of the vehicle, open the map or your inventory without getting out of character. Needless to say, immersion freaks like myself loved it and I'm thrilled Eden has worked in that direction. It"s one of the things I asked for without expecting anything like it for a couple generations if at all.

One caveat though. It remains to be seen whether we can walk anywhere or just in the designated areas mentioned already (malls, car dealerships and race starts). I don't think we should assume we can just drive anywhere, stop the car, get out and go for a walk... yet.

Another rough measurement / estimate of all roads on that map works out to ~250km. Even if my estimates are way off and it's more like 500km, then double that for offroad tracks as well, it's still only 1000km! It has to be scaled up in the game IMO.

I used Roadyou.com to draw a tour of the island using actual roads and the distance is 90 miles or 130 km. It's not straight roads though. There are so many twists and turns, the trip would be hard to do in less than an hour. The French preview says it takes 40min to drive around the island so something has to give. The preview also says it takes 20 minutes to drive side to side. I tried a straight (as much as possible) itinerary across the island, top to bottom, and the 20min + are plausible.

Today I tried to measure all the asphalt roads on the island, save for city streets. I'm still not done yet, I might be at 4/5th, but I'm shocked that the combined distance is just 200 miles. I measured 4/5th of Ibiza town, just to have an idea, and the combined distance is roughly 50 miles. At this point, even with the myriad of dirt roads and offroad trails and all the towns and developments, I just can't see 2500 miles on that island.

So I have to back down from what I believed originally, a 1:1 reproduction. On the other hand, I've verified that Eden couldn't have blown up Ibiza to make it 2.5x bigger than Oahu. The more reasonable explanation, at this point, is that they blew it up enough to bring it closer to Oahu in size, and made up wide and fast roads in order to keep speed freaks from hanging on to TDU 1 the way many people hanged on to San Andreas because GTA IV was smaller.

When the first in-game pics started to appear prior to TDU's release, few people believed they were real. The devs were hanging out at the first non-Atari forum so I asked one of them how much the images had been retouched. He assured us they were untouched. I didn't believe him. They looked way to good to be real. Well... they were real! I have no reason to believe this time will be different.

Better graphics and 2 more vehicles but the camera was better on the other one.

http://geoquake.jp/en/webgame/DrivingSimulatorGM/

Yeah, I hope the guy releases a combination of the two. I'm diying to drive around of the island, see how long it takes based on the real road network.

Too bad it doesn't include a gps or a map, and a car that goes faster than 99mph but hey it'll do until the beta or demo.

I was disappointed at first but because of the Island's vibe. But then I checked it out on Google Earth and it's a fantastic playground. One Gamereactor preview mentions Eden reproduced the Island with almost painful accuracy, only modifying "some"' roads and decor elements. If Eden has packed 2.5x more roads on that small islands as I hope they did, it's going to be far more diverse, memorable, challenging, awe inspiring than Oahy could ever dream of being. And don't forget Oahu's lack of weather diversity and 24H cycle didn't help. This game's lasting power could far surpass the first opus.

By the way you can start training here: http://geoquake.jp/en/webgame/DrivingSimulatorPerspective/

I don't remember detours. This said, whenever I play TDU I always drive around the island without detours. When I drive casual it takes me well over an hour. If I floor it it's between 55min and an hour. Oahu's roads are pretty straight and wide, Ibiza is all twists and turns. Even if Eden modified some of the roads I doubt they haven't dramatically altered the road network to make it like in the US. So 40min can mean actual size, a bit of upscaling as Hoax suggested, but no way it can mean 2.5x Oahu's landmass.

You may be right. There are many roads large enough for just one car but they could enlarge these without blowing up the whole island. Even with the 6-ft wide e-lane they put everywhere on Oahu there's still enough room to leave the landmass untouched.

At any rate it seems impossible to me that they blew up the whole island to 2.5 times the size of Oahu, otherwise it would take 2,5 h to drive around and 45 mn across.

@Hoax @DeathDriver @Blackhole I don't know why I didn't think about it sooner... proof that the island can't be bigger than Oahu? Just check the Millionaire Challenge on TDU. You got the gold if you could drive around the island in less than 60 minutes. You could do it in 45min but that implied blasting at 200mph the whole time on the emergency lane and not crashing once.

So it's obviously the same deal as going from San Andreas to GTA 4. Less landmass but more detail.

@Hoax

Based on measurements by other players Oahy was 1:1. Based on the previews already published the devs went for realism and a more Rally/offroad-oriented theme. Based on GE there are a great many roads packed on this island. And no one has said the island had been blown up, it's just speculation from a player.

The game is set on the real island of Ibiza, Scaled up to make it 2.5x bigger than Oahu of TDU1

I'm not sure about this one. Using Google Earth's ruler tool, draw a straight line from south to north and it comes at 22 miles. that's assuming they created a straight road, which is more than doubtful. Then if you quickly draw a linear intinerary around the island the whole distance will come at over 60 miles. At an average of 80mph that's 40minutes+.

Has anyone here played with Google Earth a bit? Using the ruler tool I followed a mix of asphalt and dirt roads around Ibiza, sticking as close to the coast as possible. My round trip came up at 127 Miles. I originally set out to measure all the roads (naively) so I didn't drive twice on the same road so its length wouldnt be counted twice, which left out a lot of sightseeing.

First observation: the character and diversity are mind blowing. It has the potential to be something epic. It all depends on the graphics engine though and I'm a bit worried because the few shots already released remind me of yet another tropical paradise rather than a mediterranean setting.

Second observation: if Eden stuck as close to reality as possible, explorers and rallye racing fans should be the biggest winners. Biggest losers: guys who like to cruise at 200mph in A class cars. I don't really see the potential for that.

Lastly, the idea of a 1:1, "Google Earth perfect" Ibiza boggles the mind but I'd say the idea that there are roughly 2000 miles of roads on Ibiza, dirt roads included, doesn't seem so far fetch. Next step will be to keep my excitement in check to avoid mindcrushing disappointments.

Oh... my... GOD. Huge Miami Vice fan here, I can't thank you enough for what you're doing here.

I already made the proper Florida ZAQ 178 License plate long ago, I only need to recover the files from whatever HDD I dumped them in. Oh and learn how to mod clothes in-game. My favorite MV tunes are already in-game so I'm clear on that side.

As Al Pacino would say: Just when I thought I was out (of TDU)... they pull me back in!