Diesel sport cars

[And3rs]

Went for a long drive in my car together with my dad. Roads are full of snow so I ended up doing many nice slides/drifts here and there. -5*C but still had the roof down, not cold at all. Great fun! :cool:

Did this again... :lol:

Did this again... :lol: Although today I drove for like two hours...

[mau92]

Yes, it is REALLY fast haha. Can't wait to have my license so I can find a bit of highway while driving our m550d^^

I get piss scared everytime my dad hammers it, it causes me so much vertigo (the acceleration) haha,.

 

You're lucky. Parents said they won't let me drive the 135i when I get my license (hopefully) in August.

 

I guess I'm pretty lucky. I drove for almost an entire week my dad's 328i (Sport, btw :P ) F30 on empty roads, here in Argentina. It's amazing how it reacts, when you want to overtake trucks and/or cars, and it gets pretty funny with the paddle shifter. Even better, my dad had no problem with me stepping on it though my mom yelled when I reached 180 km/h :rolleyes:

I'm waiting for an invitation for the BMW Driving Experience... I could've go to one, but my dad erased the emails ¬¬ . Sorry for going a bit off topic.

[TIMELESS]

I guess I'm pretty lucky. I drove for almost an entire week my dad's 328i (Sport, btw :P ) F30 on empty roads, here in Argentina. It's amazing how it reacts, when you want to overtake trucks and/or cars, and it gets pretty funny with the paddle shifter. Even better, my dad had no problem with me stepping on it though my mom yelled when I reached 180 km/h :rolleyes:

I'm waiting for an invitation for the BMW Driving Experience... I could've go to one, but my dad erased the emails ¬¬ . Sorry for going a bit off topic.

 

Fantastic. My dad won't let me near the 2.2 diesel Lexus.... (and definitely not the GT-Four) so I've mostly been learning in my mates Lupo TDI. :lol:

[calster17]

Some of this is a case of TL;DR but i get the genral jist of it all, I'll throw my hat into the ring....I can guess some of you's are groaning at this due to my 'interesting' likes & dislikes of the motoring world. ;)

 

An outright diesel sports car? Just't doesn't make me feel excited in the slightest, maybe i'm old hat in that respect.

 

But a diesel car that's sporting? Yes.

 

Lemme expand on that. Le-Mans...alot of people have said it's now a bit dull thanks to all the diesel-Hybrid crap, the sound of the GT1 cars was better than the diesels when they first came out. Also remember when Audi made the R8 TDi V12? It just seemed a bit pointless to me, again maybe it's just me being a bit old skool in my thinking. If your after a sports car but concerned about MPG, I think your after the wrong sort of car. And don't get me started on the (thankfully) failed attempt at making a diesel TVR.

 

A sporting diesel? Maybe not in the way your thinking. I'm lucky to have driven a large number of cars & vans(and lorrys) and I can honestly say that I do love a nice punchy diesel. Ton's of low down torque and your laughing, be it a nice twisty road or traffic light GP. I've had some great fun in a diesel. (it's 20% cooler when it's a works van or rental car ;) )Sure the diesels I've driven were never designed to be sporty, but they sure give me bucket loads of fun as well as giving me some good MPG figures. Hell, even i'm eyeing up a few diesels for my next car. because with some basic ECU 'chipping you can get some lul crazy torques!

And lets not forget that the car I idolize, my 'god car' is a deisel....Rover 75 CDT. I can tell you that was one hell of a car, but no way a sports car!

[mau92]

Don't forget, Calster, that racing is a proving ground for new technologies on cars. For example all the aero work or carbon fiber, now we have street cars (expensive ones, but are street-legal anyways) that have active aero and are made with composites. If engineers can prove a diesel engine can take over a race of 24h on a high regime, then they can use all that info into a street car thus making them more reliable for the average guy (who doesn't want to spend a lot in repairs).

And I have to agree, those GT1 engines sound good, the petrol ones...

[The Compensator]

Well, originally we were discussing whether a premium German diesel sedan from Munich is a sporty vehicle. And no one can be after a diesel sports car purely because there is not a diesel sports car on the market. Thankfully. I don't want a 911 Diesel S. Eh.

 

And bringing Le Mans to this is a bit off since it's another league, something different. Audi is using e-tron's to show what they can do and what is possible within the regualations and within the limits of today's technology. It's basically the same scheme as the so-called hypercars - P1, LaF, 918. Porsche used the hybrid technology, again, to show what is possible. They could have built the 918 without the e-motors , batteries and such. And make it lighter and faster than the Carrera GT was.

 

/endofftopic

 

Diesels are just a rational choice. People are buying them because low MPG, yo. You know, for someone, who does 200 km a day, are ~ 3 liters in favor of diesel a lot. Another reason, as I see it, are (were) the old lazy NA petrol engines choken up by emission regulations. Turbochargers really helped them petrols, latest variation of VAG's 1.4 T(F)SI is really good, fast and yet has great MPG for example. So you really have to do your maths to find out if a petrol or diesel is the right choice... Unfortunately, some people don't look left and right and go straight ahead for diesel blinded by MPG in brochures.

[Milli]

My opinion? (If it worth something :lol: )

 

If you buy an expensive car, being a diesel one, just because the MPG saving... sounds a bit greedy, or... "closed hand"...

 

A Lupo TDI is fine because the whole point of the car is being cheap and save you money, but when it's about an expensive car, it just gets controversial.

[RobikV3]

Yep although almost all S classes, 5 series, passats, A6s and all other premium cars are diesiels here FTW

[mau92]

My opinion? (If it worth something :lol: )

 

If you buy an expensive car, being a diesel one, just because the MPG saving... sounds a bit greedy, or... "closed hand"...

 

A Lupo TDI is fine because the whole point of the car is being cheap and save you money, but when it's about an expensive car, it just gets controversial.

 

I think everybody's opinion is worth at least there are some regulations here :P

And regarding your point I agree, I mean if you have the money to get a car in the range of 3/C/A4 series and above then you have no problem with petrol prices...

Btw, diesel here is has bad quality and premium diesel (which is the one to go for premium cars) is almost as expensive as premium petrol, so there you go...

[Fear Deer]

 

If you buy an expensive car, being a diesel one, just because the MPG saving... sounds a bit greedy, or... "closed hand"...

 

It's not that straight forward, and I think you can only tell what you'll do when it's your turn to do it.

We could have afforded the M5 rather than the M550d, but a car's payment is something that we're agreeing to, and that's something we can control and are prepared to do. However fuel prices are insane, specially petrol. And each time you fill up the tank, even with the diesel, since we can't go under 11.0L/100km, It's a big ammount of money we're spending, and we have to fill up the tank every week, and it's not driven too much. Each month we spend around 250€ in fuel. That's 3000 per year. Then you also have the insurance which is not cheap.

 

The M5 would turn out much more expensive on the run, expecting around 320-350€ of fuel per month. With 300 per month you can buy a small car lol.

When you buy a car you can't just account what you're paying when you get the keys.

Also due to the price cathegory of our car we pay an extra 20% of fuel price, so on top of the 3000€ of fuel per year we pay another 20% of that.

And for which reason would we get the M5 instead? None, we don't race, we don't track the cars. My father only stretches it when the roads are empty at night or in highway driving, most of the days he's under 50-60km/h. I already think that our car is to powerful for what we can do on our roads.

 

We've already been in situations in which we think, I'd do this and that if I were going to do X instead of doing what someone did, but when it's your

turn to decide on the very same thing you'll think it over better^^

 

Just saying, things are not that straight forward xD

[Milli]

Sorry, but why not get the M5? If you had money to buy and keep one... it's an M5 already, you really care about money being thrown away?

 

As you said, you don't race, your parents doesn't either, why get such an expensive car? A normal 5 series would do the job easily, like the A6 did. Do you see my point here?

 

When you spend more than 100.000 euros on a car, fuel money sure isn't a problem.

[Fear Deer]

Exactly, the ammount of power on our car is already un necessary, why buy an even more powerful one? We were to get the Bi TDi A7, we just went to bmw to get low prices to poke the audi guys with to get an even lower price, but they did a great deal on the m550d xD. And they also offered us 5 years of free service/repairs. And keeping the M5 would be even more expensive, the money spent on it can be used on another necessary and pleasurable things.

And we'd gain nothing by having the m5, we wouldn't be able to drive it any faster than we do atm, since we don't even drive our car to it's full potential.

It would just make us spend more money without having gains.

[Milli]

The M550d already does that. :lol: (And it will never be an M5)

 

My point is, what's a fart for someone who already pooped in the pants?

[Fear Deer]

can't agree with you sorry :/ It's easy to take a 5 second decision based on what we'd prefer or think we'd enjoy more and just shout it.

But things don't work that way. When you have to manage money perfectly, keeping a company, cars, family, house, employees, machines, university, kids, vacations, and if you want to save money too incase it's necessary, and if you don't want to drain your budget every month, you can't just go along with the "hell with it" thought.

Buying the M5 would not have been rational, and buying our car was possibly not the most rational thing ever.

It's good to be able to save money, we never know how things will be in a few years.

If you get the chance to buy a M5 and if you can spend the money without having to worry about how you're going to manage it I do encourage you to do so :)

 

Money does not grow on trees, it's something you harvest from your work. And the more you spend the less you have.

[Milli]

If i had so many things to keep and care, i wouldn't buy a high end expensive diesel car. I'd get something cheaper. That's how i think about car spends.

 

Get an expensive car, but then look out for fuel money... to me that sounds wrong, and i wouldn't do such thing. I'd get a BMW 540i or something like that.

 

The BMW 550i is about the same price as the m550d and has 450hp, instead of 381hp. Both cost about 106.000. But, if i had so many things to keep and care about, i'd get a 535i, which has 306hp and costs 76.000. And i don't think it will be much worse than a 550i.

 

But that's me, my opinion. It's not about being the right thing or the wrong. That's my way of thinking when getting a car.

[The Compensator]

I'm ill and not feeling very well, so a short sum-up of my opinion:

 

It's not about the amount of money the rich (or just well financially secured) has, but it's about his personality and point of view on cars. If a person has the money to buy an M5, it doesn't mean he automatically goes and buys it because he can afford it. Nope. Nuno already explained it to you very well and I totally agree with him despite the fact I wouldn't buy an M550xd but that's just, you know, well, my opinion, man. An M car or any other high-performance car is more expensive to run than a normal version of the car. That's a fact.

 

No offense Milli, and I don't want to sound cocky, but you don't get it because you don't have the €€€'s. You're not the only whose is opinion like that. :)

 

Edit: The M550xd is even more expensive than the 550i in Germany. And yes, personally I'd go for the 535d.

 

And by cheaper car, you mean what car?

[Fear Deer]

There are several reasons not to get the 550i. It has the crappy F10 Electric Power Steering, pays higher taxes, it's slower than our car, consumes more fuel than our car, doesn't have the chassis and suspension made for the m550d, and since their base cost is identical, the m550d is a better car for us.

If we had the m5 we would have to save less money, and my parents also want to save some money to build up a nice ammount after they sell the company once they retire.

 

Anyways, as you said, purchasing cars is all about one's opinion and preference, I don't have to justify why we buy X and not Y, but I do agree that within the price range of our car, ours was the wisest choice both in upkeeping costs and usability. Even if you have millions, if you go spending them like you just don't care, you'll run out^^

[Milli]

I will quote myself guys... my first comment:

 

My opinion?[/color] (If it worth something :lol: )[/b]

 

If you buy an expensive car, being a diesel one, just because the MPG saving... sounds a bit greedy, or... "closed hand"...

 

A Lupo TDI is fine because the whole point of the car is being cheap and save you money, but when it's about an expensive car, it just gets controversial.

 

And hell yes i don't have money. My father has a Fiat Punto and can't even buy me a 1000 brl videogame if i don't save the whole year and get money together with my brothers!

 

That's why, more than you guys think, i know how to buy a practical car when you need money, and for daily uses, i really can't see a point to get a car more expensive than a Subaru Impreza WRX. Just the WRX, not the STi. Or something like that.

 

It's a car that will last your whole life, it's awd, it's a 4-door saloon and has enough power to go over 200km/h easily. That's the cheaper car i meant. If you buy anything else more than a car like this, it's taste and it's waste money on the car.

 

Why buy then? Because many other things... taste, preferences, status, whatever reason you want... it's not my business and it doesn't matter. In my opinion, if you spend so much money on a car, care about fuel prices is some "closed hand" action, because you've already spent more than necessary when buying the car itself. My mind won't change.

 

Sure, some people can't have a WRX, because they need space, other need more ground clearance, but the avarage, city citzien doesn't need any more than that.

[The Compensator]

I will quote myself guys... my first comment:

 

I know it's your opinion, you don't have to remind me?

 

And hell yes i don't have money. My father has a Fiat Punto and can't even buy me a 1000 brl videogame if i don't save the whole year and get money together with my brothers!

 

That's why, more than you guys think, i know how to buy a practical car when you need money, and for daily uses, i really can't see a point to get a car more expensive than a Subaru Impreza WRX. Just the WRX, not the STi. Or something like that.

 

It's a car that will last your whole life, it's awd, it's a 4-door saloon and has enough power to go over 200km/h easily. That's the cheaper car i meant. If you buy anything else more than a car like this, it's taste and it's waste money on the car.

 

Why buy then? Because many other things... taste, preferences, status, whatever reason you want... it's not my business and it doesn't matter. In my opinion, if you spend so much money on a car, care about fuel prices is some "closed hand" action, because you've already spent more than necessary when buying the car itself. My mind won't change.

 

Sure, some people can't have a WRX, because they need space, other need more ground clearance, but the avarage, city citzien doesn't need any more than that.

 

Hmmm. You're close, Milli but still not gettting it. And you're comparing apples to chocolate: An Impreza in any trim is a totally different animal. I thought you had meant a Passat/Mondeo. Something like this.

 

If you want a 5er, you know what you want. And why. You don't cross shop.

[mau92]

I get the 2 points of view of this discussion. It's ok, if can pay for a car doesn't mean necessarily you can afford it. And milli, for the everyday city citizen, as you said, any car with a small engine and AC (because everybody hates hot and cities :P ) will do the trick. Then why buying a bigger car? Because you like it, you can afford it, you enjoy it and any other things that anyone wants to add to the list.

There are people that just want an Audi/BMW/MB or whatever but they don't need all those HP's so they get the "Base pack", and there's other who can afford it, can pay for it and they like cars and then there they go.

I think that this conversation is related to every particular person here...

[RX_37]

It's not that straight forward, and I think you can only tell what you'll do when it's your turn to do it.

We could have afforded the M5 rather than the M550d, but a car's payment is something that we're agreeing to, and that's something we can control and are prepared to do. However fuel prices are insane, specially petrol. And each time you fill up the tank, even with the diesel, since we can't go under 11.0L/100km, It's a big ammount of money we're spending, and we have to fill up the tank every week, and it's not driven too much. Each month we spend around 250€ in fuel. That's 3000 per year. Then you also have the insurance which is not cheap.

 

The M5 would turn out much more expensive on the run, expecting around 320-350€ of fuel per month. With 300 per month you can buy a small car lol.

When you buy a car you can't just account what you're paying when you get the keys.

Also due to the price cathegory of our car we pay an extra 20% of fuel price, so on top of the 3000€ of fuel per year we pay another 20% of that.

And for which reason would we get the M5 instead? None, we don't race, we don't track the cars. My father only stretches it when the roads are empty at night or in highway driving, most of the days he's under 50-60km/h. I already think that our car is to powerful for what we can do on our roads.

 

We've already been in situations in which we think, I'd do this and that if I were going to do X instead of doing what someone did, but when it's your

turn to decide on the very same thing you'll think it over better^^

 

Just saying, things are not that straight forward xD

 

So why do you have a 550d at all? :P Why not a 528d or 520d? You could cut the monthly costs in half with that.

 

--- Post Updated ---

 

Anyway someone mentioned diesel sports cars?

 

[Fear Deer]

So why do you have a 550d at all? :P Why not a 528d or 520d? You could cut the monthly costs in half with that.

 

 

Not complaining, no reason to. Just explaining why things are not that straight forward..has money for m5, then get m5 :)

[Milli]

I know it's your opinion, you don't have to remind me?

 

Yes, i do, because you seem to have forget that.

 

Hmmm. You're close, Milli but still not gettting it. And you're comparing apples to chocolate: An Impreza in any trim is a totally different animal. I thought you had meant a Passat/Mondeo. Something like this.

 

If you want a 5er, you know what you want. And why. You don't cross shop.

 

And they are not different, when you take it by logic. They are cars, things to move you from A to B. And to me, a WRX is the top in the logical choice. Anything else is a plus and a want. If you get a diesel because you want one, fine... but please don't come at me with this "money savings" excuses. Specially with expensive cars.

 

I am sorry, but 100.000 on a car, money sure isn't a problem... specially when you put real logic in between.

[Fear Deer]

Milli I'm so sorry and I don't want to nutpick at all, but your comment shows no logic at all.

[The Compensator]

Yes, i do, because you seem to have forget that.

 

I think this is a normal discussion.

 

And they are not different, when you take it by logic. They are cars, things to move you from A to B. And to me, a WRX is the top in the logical choice. Anything else is a plus and a want. If you get a diesel because you want one, fine... but please don't come at me with this "money savings" excuses. Specially with expensive cars.

 

I am sorry, but 100.000 on a car, money sure isn't a problem... specially when you put real logic in between.

 

You are a masochist then if you think the WRX is the ultimate all-rounder. I wouldn't fancy driving it from Berlin to Monaco in four people. Do you know by any chance what's the mileage on those?

 

A rich person, in my view, is a (multi)millionare. And honestly, do you really believe that one premium diesel sedan worth 100k makes that person rich? No. A wealthy person has enough money to buy a Bentley Conti, S 63, Ghost or something like that, and in addition he may also own a villa in the Mediterrean and leave his secured residence to go there in his W12 Conti every summer.

 

Once again:

 

Not every person is interested in cars as much as we are. This applies to everyone in every social class. Poor, middle class, upper class, rich, etc.

Not everyone wants to daily drive a 560hp sedan in a manner I would like to drive every morning in.

Not everyone has the skills to drive a fast and powerful vehicle. Intelligent people know where their driving skills lie.

Not everyone wants to show off his wealth.

Not every wealthy person throws his money out of the window, so that person may have an F-Type V8 S next to his black, anonymous, daily driven diesel S-class.